Thanks to Alf C. who brought this video to my attention over on his Twitter.
Apologist David Wood of Acts 17 Ministries has done a video that talked about the Ravi scandal. I know a lot of people are commenting but I think this is one of the better discussions out there and also has some applications for everyone: apologists, those in ministry, every day Christians, judgmental Christians, enablers, etc.
Its very good.
Here it is:
I think his assessment is fair and Biblical and also is sensitive to the victims and also more importantly insightful how this crisis happened. For me it was also insightful his discussion of why sometimes God answers “no” to our prayers such as people praying for apologist Nabeel Q to be healed from his cancer. I trust it will be as edifying for you as it was for me.
Thanks for sharing this. Somehow, we keep getting surprised by reality of sexual deviation of our leaders. King David showed us how pernicious it can be. He had a heart after God but fell prey none the less.
Of course, Jesus knew that it comes from lust and the power it can exert. We all need to take care.
What a great tragedy for his legacy and the ministry. I’m praying for all for restoration.
Blessings.
Thank you for this video. I will be watching later today.
The secret sins unveiled about Ravi was rather shocking for many Christians and I see that impact among Christians who are more into apologetics from online interactions and for me the rape claims, that’s so horrific. But I’m a firm believer every major fall didn’t happen out of nowhere, it took thousands of little steps of sins and compromises to get there…oh how important is sanctifying grace amen Crissy?
I totally agree. It’s like for instance in my experience, someone places a family size pizza in front of me, of course I am NOT going to eat the whole pizza, but as I begin with little bites here and there before you know it I shocked everyone by having consumed the whole pizza.
We need to watch the little bites of sin we allow in our lives.
Great video, thanks for sharing. Stop the leader worship, all organizations should have better accountability structures, etc.
I agree with you 100%! Accountability and transparency are lacking in all of these current scandals. I read somewhere that when you name a ministry after yourself, it is too easy for the ministry to exist and exalt the person rather than Christ. I think there is truth in that.
Well, if that isn’t a conversation starter, I don’t know what is. Of course, David is not your typical Christian, which isn’t necessarily a bad thing. On the other hand, he definitely did lay out an awful lot of possible ammunition that could be used against himself and inadvertently, other Christians. I don’t disagree with any of the logic or Biblical examples that he uses, although the will power aspect did appear to circumvent the reality of God strengthening us through His indwelling Holy Spirit. His style of delivery is rather unique and quite effective, according to my own personal observation. David definitely knows how to make a point. David does cover a lot in that time period and I would have to go back over it again in greater detail but overall I would think that what he speaks of is a reality check that does need to be acknowledged and addressed. Perfectionism (be ye Holy as I am Holy) is something that all of us aim for, but I don’t believe any of us actually ever really achieve as Christians, while we reside in these bodies and that in itself is a topic that has a tendency to be avoided or at least placed at a level that is counter productive. When God says that His thoughts are not our thoughts and His ways are not our ways, I don’t think we really comprehend the difference that is being pointed to there, between God and ourselves. And when we include not only our actions but also our thoughts, like Jesus indicated was necessary, to get at truth from God’s perspective, all of us probably fail to comprehend the magnitude of that reality either. And then of course, we have the difference between infrequent sin and habitual sin and how one, if not corrected or at least put into check, can definitely lead to the other. I’ll be interested to what others have to say but I did find it both thought provoking and something that needs to be looked at, more deeper rather than superficially. Blessings Jim!
Good thoughts, lots to chew on from you. Brother, with David Wood’s background, I’m so glad God saved him, honestly I’d be afraid of him if he didn’t know Christ from his background and story. Yet in some sense so much of what he has to say was very real, and unvarnished truth about himself. I know you know Nabeel Q and it amazes me God using David Wood to reach Nabeel for the Lord. You mentioned “I don’t disagree with any of the logic or Biblical examples that he uses, although the will power aspect did appear to circumvent the reality of God strengthening us through His indwelling Holy Spirit” Like you I think maybe I disagree slightly with David Wood here or I’m not too sure myself, sometimes I think people have different kinds of moral strengths, they can be courageous to fight against injustice for example and are tireless but then other temptations such as sexual ones, they might not be as strong. Or someone might resist sexual temptations well but man they can’t resist pride. But there’s some truth with what he said since the ministers I know who fell in ministry often were tired, overworked and in their exhaustion they weren’t as strong as they should be. Overall though I think what he has to share has a lot of good points. HOw are you dealing with the cold up in Canada???
Hi Jim, I didn’t disagree with what David said about will power, I just thought he should have mentioned or included God strengthening us through His Holy Spirit also. For sure there are many ministers who are tired, overworked and nearing exhaustion. One can easily see how situations could arise that one could be tempted in and accountability isn’t always implemented as it needs to be. Yes, David did raise a good number of valid points and his insight on Nabeel was enlightening. Some of David’s methods can be a little controversial at times so it should be interesting to see what the uptake is on this video. How am I dealing with the cold you ask? We had some snow a few days ago and while it was a storm of sorts, it wasn’t off the wall and we handled it quite effectively. Our temperatures are staying around 32F so it’s not bad at all, actually mild compared to some winters we’ve gone through and there definitely is a trend to have milder winters here, than we used to get. It has been colder out in the West versus here in the East by the sea coast, so no real complaints and underground parking doesn’t hurt either. I’m pretty sure you are busy all of the time, make sure to try to balance the workload with attending family needs and a little R&R for yourself when you can manage it. Let me know how you are doing when you get a chance. Really appreciate you as a brother Jim. God’s grace, peace and blessings to you and yours. Love in Christ. – Bruce
Thank you. I will watch tomorrow.
[…] David Wood’s Video: Making Sense of the Ravi Zacharias Scandal […]
Sanctification truly matters and so does accountability
Many wolves in sheep’s clothing. Ravi Zacharias will fulfill these verses below
21 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of My Father who is in heaven will enter. 22 Many will say to Me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name perform many miracles?’ 23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; leave Me, you who practice lawlessness.’ -Matthew 7:21-23
Many fake Christians have flourishing ministries, but behind close doors, they are like one without God’s law doing that which they preach against.
For example. Judas Iscariot was used by the Lord Jesus Christ to go out, in pairs, and cast out demons, heal the sick, and preach the good news. The ones that Judas was preaching to didn’t know how evil he really was until the night that he betrayed Jesus Christ and was found out what was in his heart.
Thanks for your comment; his fruit is definitely very concerning. Did you read or listened to Ravi before in the past?
Yes. I listened to his arguments about God’s existence which was good. One thing though that bothered me was that he liked to quote many people and never seemed to have his personal insights. That’s how it came out for me.
After watching sparingly half of the video, there are three things that come to mind. One, GOD is Sovereign and He knows beforehand what this man will be doing but He uses this as an example for us to ponder on, Never let go of Him as our Savior from our sins, and ask Him regularly to lead us from temptation because the devil wants to target His messengers. Two, the message (an “argument” in the words of the presenter) should be separated from the messenger and those words were inpired by GOD and not owned by the messenger/vessel. And third, only JESUS CHRIST is perfect, everyone has sins, miscalculations, and prideful mistakes, including Paul and Peter. That is how really important GOD’s Grace is. Honestly, I’ve not heard of His sermons although his name was in oneplace.com. This reminded me of my favorite Christian song by Steve Green, “may all who come behind us, find us faithful.”
Wow brother those are good three points that you shared! You’re right no one is perfect and how much more we need God’s grace to follow Him and also to be sanctified! Important is also your point 2 of how the message is got to be believed more than just because of the human messenger. A church I know had a pastor fall into sexual immorality and it really stretched everyone in my opinion to make sure they believe it is because of Christ, and not just because of a strong personality. Joyful to have you this morning for Bible study!
Likewise, Jim! The lesson was edifying and salient as we are entering the Omni discussion/lesson. Going back, true, it is GOD who gave those words for both pastor and lay, and when it is Biblical and it is good for edifying regardless of the human messenger. But it is sometimes hard for us, humans to separate the edifying message with the voice, especially when put the messenger on a pedestal (as the presenter mentioned) and they fail. On a similar note, it is hard to listen to a previous video of a sermon when we know that the voice is of someone with a scandal. Only GOD can make the person see the good in those Words from a dubious source.
A beautiful post thank you so much
Very good But the consenting women are not blameless. Christian or not. Just a thought. Sad for victims. In prayer.
Thanks for the video! I had to go into work today for six hours and listened it while prepping and commuting. I wondered where he was going at the end with a lengthy discourse on his own personal foibles, but I get it. He made a lot of good points. Yup, Christians hide their weaknesses and failings as part of the game we all play to a degree. A lot of believers don’t want to discuss Ravi’s scandal, but it’s a good teaching moment for individuals and the church in general. I have one more post re: Ravi brewing in my head.
Wow is this six more hours of work for you this week or you starting work earlier for this week? Am I correct to read your comment to see that there’s a Ravi post coming for your blog?
The boss asked me to come in today for six hours to train with one of the Mon.-Thurs. people. The time spent was actually quite productive. How different Harris is from Kodak. There was zero overtime at Kodak the last twelve years or so for obvious reasons, but at Harris OT is the norm.
RE: Ravi
I listened to a video yesterday about the Ravi scandal. The speaker made some good points that I wanted to build upon.
Hey! I was never really interested in Ravi. His style was not the same as mine and so I had a hard time watching and listening to him. However, I have been following this situation closely. I do think this is a necessary conversation that the Church needs to have on so many levels as this is such an affront to God! I have never heard of David Wood until this video. I think he is correct. How we end this life matters. In many ways it matters more than what we do in this life. Our sin will most certainly find us out. Ravi’s, his family, board etc, their sin has been exposed and needs to be dealt with. I view my life like Wood does his. I am not out to hide anything. There’s wisdom and discernment with sharing, but it is never to cover up, hide or deny. myself making myself look better than what I am. The Lord knows my mistakes, my sin, my shortcomings. I own my sin and my mistakes. The more I try to cover up my past sins the more God gives me opportunities to speak about them, like Wood.
In this digitally retouched world, people crave authenticity and transparency more than ever (even though truth is subject and feelings matter more than absolutes, I can’t reconcile that but I digress). and Christians should be the realest people on the planet. What astounds me the most about this whole scandal is that people knew and willfully and purposefully did nothing about it. This happens in churches and ministries more than we know. I had a friend in Seminary, her daughter was molested by their pastor, all that happened to that pastor was that he was moved to a different church. The board thought he was a dynamic speaker and since he appeared repentant they decided to move him to a different church with more accountability. There was no contacting authorities or alerting the new congregation of what happened.
The same in my opinion is true of Ravi. People knew and they purposefully and willfully hid the truth, blaming victims to save their brand. This is truly on par with Bill Cosby. I seriously hope that RZIM disbands and sets up a trust for the victims or donates their funds to ministries that help survivors of abuse. Thank you for sharing this video. I will definitely be watching more of Wood’s YouTube videos!
I just saw that Ravi’s denomination The Christian and Missionary Alliance has revoked Ravi’s ordination. I have absolutely no clue what good that does to anyone now other than people are going to want to run as far away from Ravi as possible. This is another side of the story that is enraging, people who supported him will run to cover themselves and then there are those who will defend Ravi no matter what. The Church is being exposed on so many levels.
A very good comment; you mentioned about the pastor whom they just moved to another church who was in leadership when he abused a minor; that is horribly wicked. Man, that is sooo wrong. He should be out of the ministry and in jail. I think that’s my biggest fears, is someone molested in our church. I often let people know in the pulpit and conversations that there is zero tolerance to enable abuses and abusers, anyone hurts kids is going to have the authorities be involved, no ifs, buts and whatabout… about it. I’m disappointed with the C&MA which ordained Ravi, they investigated the charges a few years ago and cleared him of wrong doing and now they did it again and removed his ordination? How were they investigating before??? It seems C&MA was going with the flow of what Big Eva and pop Christian think, instead of going by truth. The committee that investigated ought to be investigated themselves for the sake of churches in the denomination that has questions about how this can be so? Removing his ordination after his death and after public opinion tide turn seems more a political move than to face tough questions how C&MA investigation and also accountability works! You can probably tell I’m getting kind of passionate here as someone who donates and support the missions work of the C&MA (among many other groups)…Going back to your comment, honestly to be truthful I learn more from David Wood’s apologetics more than Ravi. Wood to some can be rough around the edges, and he has probably the most craziest testimonies I’ve ever heard an apologist have but he’s very insightful and informative and makes so many of his materials and contents of substance for free, and that’s a part of my own heartbeat, trying to roll out contents that hopefully is God honoring and for free. Your friend with the daughter, did they ever get the police involved???
That’s an excellent point about C&MA investigating him earlier and clearing him. I also think the board and investigators should be investigated as well. What angers me and you know me and you know my heart so I am not coming from a bad place. Ravi grew up in India, he knows the corruption and exploitation of people in India. He denounced how they treated people yet he preyed and I mean preyed on the poor and vulnerable. For those who refuse to believe that Ravi did anything wrong or that you shouldn’t speak ill of the dead, if Ravi was innocent, Christian ministries and retailers would not be pulling his works off the shelves like they are. Money truly does talk and it is disgusting. So much of what is happening here is political and brand protecting. God is not pleased.
There should be ZERO tolerance from Christians with abuse, especially when it comes to children. The church is a haven for abuse and abusers and I hate it! For my friend, the police were never involved. While there was evidence of molestation, when my friend contacted the next church to warn them, the former church said my friend was lying. How horrible is that! Years later it was found out that this man had allegations against him from every church he was at, but instead of dealing with it, they kept moving him to different churches. While my friend’s daughter is not really haunted by what happened, my friend is. She grieves that she did not do more.
Unrelated, I am amazed that the gov’t/military didn’t recruit Wood.
He makes a lot of very good point but I worry that the speaker be ok and hope God protect him with his own trials
Ravi should have been dismissed and ignored long ago. I was reading up on how he flagrantly falsified his resume and lied many times about studying and teaching at Cambridge. Once you catch a guy doing that, why trust anything he says?
While we are regularly disappointed by revelations regarding the behaviors of individuals we either admire or look up to, we should never really be surprised. We are fallen individuals in a fallen world. Romans tells us exactly who we are and the struggles with sin that we will face in our walk to be more like Christ Jesus. We continually fail to recognize that the world is our enemy and that the message that our culture is advancing is counterintuitive to the Gospel of our Lord and Savior. That message of independence leads us to the doorstep of pride, and once that door is opened we unleash all sorts of hurt on others and ourselves. Been there, done that. And the deception of this world is so subtle.
I found David Wood’s video refreshing in the fact that he owns up to his fallen nature even to the point of providing ammunition to his detractors. If people knew some of the thoughts that ran through my head, I am sure they would be disappointed. It is human nature to minimize our failings and shortcomings, and as Christians, it is difficult to come to grips that we fall short on a daily basis.
The good news is that there is One who is perfect; who died on the Cross so that we would be seen as holy and blameless before our Father through faith in His Son. It is only by coming to the recognition of who we are and who Christ Jesus is that we come to that saving faith. It is only through a process of daily surrender through prayer and confession that I am able to navigate this world.
Thank you for sharing the video. Andy
This is excellent insight on Mr.Zacharias . The explanation on willpower, actually just set me free from a particular yoke of false condemnation, so thank you for that! It is amazing how God can accomplish several things just by one servant being obedient!
Anyone can fall. And everybody need to cling to Jesus.
I love David Wood and his wife, they are very genuine and whilst I see that David is flawed at times due to his nature, it makes it even more amazing that God blessed them with 5 children, 2 who are very disabled. Yet these two married whilst very young and have made it through many years, and it takes a very strong couple to survive that. David is without a doubt a very complex man and Marie was Gods choice for him, as she understands him and loves him unconditionally, she is a remarkable woman.
Ravi’s wife have come out defending him
I find this a bit disturbing. That is so messed up. Put a move on my wife and daughter and get messed up! I don’t care if you are Billy Graham!
Ravi was a hero. I’m glad you posted this from David Wood, it’s one of the best I’ve seen about Ravi’s scandal